<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
	>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Causation</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.investigations.4-lom.com/2008/03/19/causation/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.investigations.4-lom.com/2008/03/19/causation/</link>
	<description>Failing better at understanding the past</description>
	<pubDate>Tue, 06 Jan 2009 01:17:10 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.7</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Gavin Robinson</title>
		<link>http://www.investigations.4-lom.com/2008/03/19/causation/comment-page-1/#comment-13866</link>
		<dc:creator>Gavin Robinson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Mar 2008 17:05:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.investigations.4-lom.com/2008/03/19/causation/#comment-13866</guid>
		<description>This post only scratched the surface. I'll probably have more posts on the topic sooner or later.

I'd agree with you that people did things because they wanted to (or for anyone who believes in false consciousness/bad faith/whatever, because they &lt;i&gt;thought&lt;/i&gt; they wanted to). But that just leads to the question of &lt;i&gt;why&lt;/i&gt; they wanted to. That's not something I'm going to tackle in the article. I think I'll have done enough by proving that some people wanted to give material support to parliament but that many more didn't. The challenge to anyone who wants to get any further is to write all those biographies of all those people who did things, or chose not to do things - that's assuming we can know the minds of dead people in the past well enough to explain why they did things, which might be expecting too much.

A superficial problem with breaking big events down into individual actions and decisions is that it might provoke accusations of reductionism. I don't think it is necessarily reductionist, but the reasons for that lead into a bigger problem: complexity. The way that small actions combine into complex events might be too difficult to understand or describe. People's actions probably influenced each other, so that the causal chains are all tangled up together rather than forming neat lines that we can follow.

I was largely unaware of Keith Jenkins until about a year ago when I happened to sit next to him in a Philosophy of History seminar at the IHR. The speaker (Peter Burke) was quite disappointing, but the way Jenkins took him apart was brilliant. I was left thinking "Who was that man? He's a fucking genius!". I eventually found out that it was Keith Jenkins. He seems quite different in writing than in person, but his books are still very clear and engaging compared to a lot of theory.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This post only scratched the surface. I&#8217;ll probably have more posts on the topic sooner or later.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d agree with you that people did things because they wanted to (or for anyone who believes in false consciousness/bad faith/whatever, because they <i>thought</i> they wanted to). But that just leads to the question of <i>why</i> they wanted to. That&#8217;s not something I&#8217;m going to tackle in the article. I think I&#8217;ll have done enough by proving that some people wanted to give material support to parliament but that many more didn&#8217;t. The challenge to anyone who wants to get any further is to write all those biographies of all those people who did things, or chose not to do things - that&#8217;s assuming we can know the minds of dead people in the past well enough to explain why they did things, which might be expecting too much.</p>
<p>A superficial problem with breaking big events down into individual actions and decisions is that it might provoke accusations of reductionism. I don&#8217;t think it is necessarily reductionist, but the reasons for that lead into a bigger problem: complexity. The way that small actions combine into complex events might be too difficult to understand or describe. People&#8217;s actions probably influenced each other, so that the causal chains are all tangled up together rather than forming neat lines that we can follow.</p>
<p>I was largely unaware of Keith Jenkins until about a year ago when I happened to sit next to him in a Philosophy of History seminar at the IHR. The speaker (Peter Burke) was quite disappointing, but the way Jenkins took him apart was brilliant. I was left thinking &#8220;Who was that man? He&#8217;s a fucking genius!&#8221;. I eventually found out that it was Keith Jenkins. He seems quite different in writing than in person, but his books are still very clear and engaging compared to a lot of theory.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Mike Cosgrave</title>
		<link>http://www.investigations.4-lom.com/2008/03/19/causation/comment-page-1/#comment-13865</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Cosgrave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Mar 2008 14:31:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.investigations.4-lom.com/2008/03/19/causation/#comment-13865</guid>
		<description>naah...causation isn't a problem. Things are caused by human action, by choices people made within a framework or worldview in which their choices were, at least to them, rational and sensible. This covers everyone from Louis XVI (stupid choices) to the Paris mob (fearful, hungry choices). To paraphrase, History is the biography of great men and many many little people. 

I enjoy reading Jenkins, but then I enjoy reading E.H. Carr as well - doesn't mean I actually agree with them though!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>naah&#8230;causation isn&#8217;t a problem. Things are caused by human action, by choices people made within a framework or worldview in which their choices were, at least to them, rational and sensible. This covers everyone from Louis XVI (stupid choices) to the Paris mob (fearful, hungry choices). To paraphrase, History is the biography of great men and many many little people. </p>
<p>I enjoy reading Jenkins, but then I enjoy reading E.H. Carr as well - doesn&#8217;t mean I actually agree with them though!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: 12th Military History Carnival &#171; Thoughts on Military History</title>
		<link>http://www.investigations.4-lom.com/2008/03/19/causation/comment-page-1/#comment-13863</link>
		<dc:creator>12th Military History Carnival &#171; Thoughts on Military History</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 Mar 2008 13:45:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.investigations.4-lom.com/2008/03/19/causation/#comment-13863</guid>
		<description>[...] i.e. the effect that war has upon a state. A good starting point is Gavin Robinson&#8217;s post on historical causation. It provide a useful theoretical background to why events, and war in particular, occur. Next at [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] i.e. the effect that war has upon a state. A good starting point is Gavin Robinson&#8217;s post on historical causation. It provide a useful theoretical background to why events, and war in particular, occur. Next at [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
